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Author Topic: The ECB and the target debt.  (Read 283 times)

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selber

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The ECB and the target debt.
« on: July 14, 2017, 10:15 »


This is a very important point for me, because the ECB , with its power structures and its handling of the balance of payments , ensures that Germany pays what Germany , in the opinion of many French , had always should do . This has let me lose the faith in the " European spirit " .  Every Italian who bought a German product paid for it . The money ended in the Italian state bank . Why the high target debt ? Why was the money not used to pay for it and balance the balances ? And for what was the money used ? The money was there because the customer paid his purchase .  Where is the money ? I know that everyone thinks the Germans are doing well enough , they should not complain . But the handling of the balance of payments is a huge fraud which the FED would never allow . Perhaps this fraud is also a reason for the loss of competitiveness in many countries . Honest work could not compete with fraudsters . I do not know why countries that benefit most from the ECB's target system are  deepest in the crisis . But I am convinced that all the ideals behind the euro were a lie from the outset .

JoseRuiz

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2017, 18:39 »


This is a very important point for me, because the ECB , with its power structures and its handling of the balance of payments , ensures that Germany pays what Germany , in the opinion of many French , had always should do . This has let me lose the faith in the " European spirit " .  Every Italian who bought a German product paid for it . The money ended in the Italian state bank . Why the high target debt ? Why was the money not used to pay for it and balance the balances ? And for what was the money used ? The money was there because the customer paid his purchase .  Where is the money ? I know that everyone thinks the Germans are doing well enough , they should not complain . But the handling of the balance of payments is a huge fraud which the FED would never allow . Perhaps this fraud is also a reason for the loss of competitiveness in many countries . Honest work could not compete with fraudsters . I do not know why countries that benefit most from the ECB's target system are  deepest in the crisis . But I am convinced that all the ideals behind the euro were a lie from the outset .

Hi selber, I think this article will be liking you because you are always complaining.

From Süddeutsche Zeitung   11. Juli 2017, 18:00 Uhr 

Deutschland macht mit Hilfen für Griechenland Milliardengewinn

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/wirtschaft/griechenland-deutschland-macht-mit-hilfen-fuer-griechenland-milliardengewinn-1.3582710

From La Stampa  14/07/2017  17:01

Il cartello sulla porta del Papa: “Vietato lamentarsiˮ

http://www.lastampa.it/2017/07/14/vaticaninsider/ita/vaticano/il-cartello-sulla-porta-del-papa-vietato-lamentarsi-5LYcBMJuxiGmmKiv2hAwPN/pagina.html
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 19:14 by JoseRuiz »

selber

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2017, 20:12 »
@JoseRuiz
Exactly such lies about  a constantly benefiting  Germany is it what make me angry  . And against Europe . The Germans therefore profiting from  Greek government bond . More stupid one can not argue . If this were possible, the financial markets would argue about it ! The sore point is just that the Greeks will never pay back these bonds !In Germany, less investment was made in the 2000s than in the 1990s. And less than in the Eurozone. Economic growth was the second worst . How does this fit to an economically dominant Germany, with its huge balance sheet surpluses ?The reason is that these surpluses are not paid because the ECB "regulates" payment transactions . No one could pay Target debt, because the money was long spent in the state budgets . That's the financial transfer I'm talking about. I would not even get upset if it would work. But it does not work and you want more and more financial transfers from Germany .

coffejohn

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2017, 22:19 »
The European Debt Bomb Fuse Is Lit! Target2 Imbalances Hit Crisis Levels

From; http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-26/european-debt-bomb-fuse-lit-target2-imbalances-hit-crisis-levels

Quote
I had a couple of questions for the ECB regarding Target2, which they have answered, I believe disingenuously.

The article at the link above attempts to answer your point; if you can make any sense of it let me know as I cannot!

If the Brexit negotiations are a simple example of untangling EU/ECB procedures I think Germany can write off the 800 billion euros it is owed and prepare to bail out the rest of the EZone; after they have had their Dane geld from the UK.

On the bright side of the equation a lot of the T2 imbalance may be hot money from Italy etc deposited in German banks for safety.

We have had this debate before and never managed to understand how T2 imbalances are reconciled. Anyone fancy a go at it?

 
Go solar, go slow.

JoseRuiz

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2017, 14:01 »
@ selber
Since it seems that you administer what is true and what lie, would you be so kind to tell me if this news is also a lie?

Bundesverkehrsminister Alexander Dobrindt (CSU) lässt nach Informationen von SZ, NDR und WDR Dieselfahrzeuge von Daimler daraufhin untersuchen, ob der Schadstoffausstoß manipuliert wird. Das war am Donnerstag aus Kreisen des Ministeriums zu erfahren. Das Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt (KBA) werde Daimler-Modelle überprüfen, die mit einer illegalen Software programmiert sein sollen, hieß es.
Eine derartige Software führt dazu, dass die Schadstoffreinigung bei den Messungen der Behörden auf einem Prüfstand ein- und im Straßenverkehr weitgehend ausgeschaltet wird. Anlass für die Testreihe sind schwere, jetzt bekannt gewordene Anschuldigungen gegen Daimler.

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/wirtschaft/abgas-skandal-dobrindt-knoepft-sich-daimler-vor-1.3586485

And I take advantage of your deep knowledge of economics to ask you why VW compensates the Americans affected by the fraud of diesel emissions with 5000 dollars and VW does not compensate the European affected?

selber

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2017, 14:26 »
Why do not you ask why in the USA the justce enforced that customers are compensated, and not in Spain . One is the judiciary and the other is VW's fraud . I do not want to defend the justice in Spain / Europe nor VW's fraud. But VW does not make the judiciary. It has nothing at all to do with the target debt . I would have liked to see an argument to this topic . But you have no argument and prefer a cheap mud battle .
« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 14:38 by selber »

selber

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #6 on: July 16, 2017, 00:38 »
@JoseRuiz   
If I have insulted someone , or a people , I am sorry . I apologize for that . I certainly do not mean that Italians or Spaniards are fraudsters . I was out of line with the choice of words . But I think that many bankers and managers are corrupt , and that this is a basic requirement for their job . Germany is not a inocent victim either . I'm trying to explain that . Schröder was a comrade of the bosses, and his agenda 2010 was worked out by VW managers fom 1998 until 2000 . The Harz IV reforms are named after a VW manager - Peter Harz . Export companies have earned a lot with the ECB's payment mechanism , without that ,many exports would not  possible , because the were not affordable . However, Schröder is not responsible for the fraud from the EZB , but for that , that many countries could  joined the euro whose trade deficits were foreseeable . I'm still saying fraud, because it's a huge fraud for that anyone needs to  paid for  .But without this fraud, the euro would not have long survived. Because trade deficit had more quickly caused insolvency . I suppose the experts who constructed the euro thought so .
« Last Edit: July 16, 2017, 01:25 by selber »

selber

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #7 on: July 16, 2017, 01:14 »
@coffejohn
Me, does not make  smarter too , and I would also have many questions . But I lack the imagination for an satisfactory answer . Everyone knows for a long time about the target debt. No one asked, is asked only when it is too late. Public is the trick . We suspect what happens secretly , but what everyone can see will already have its correctness , we think . And when the problem is seen it is too late, and acting against it means realizing the loss . No politician wants to be responsible for this , and so , the bomb will burst at some point .
« Last Edit: July 16, 2017, 01:29 by selber »

JoseRuiz

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2017, 18:22 »
@selber
Maybe I have not explained myself well. I am not talking about economic goals, but about your loss of faith in the Union and your permanent anger. I try to make you see that the economy is a very complex issue and that Germany benefits in ways that are not marked. That seems normal to me. That is the benefit of leadership. The ransoms to Greece, we paid them all, not only Germany. And countries that have not done well, we have to borrow paying a high interest. That's the risk premium. Germany benefits from the Union, not like the indebted countries, Germany benefits from otherwise and I consider it fair. What I do not consider fair is the permanent complaint and the lack of recognition of the advantages of the Union.

The permanent complaints of some politicians who say the half-truths have led the British people to think that UK will be better outside the Union. British have not yet come out and are already beginning to doubt their decision based on the lies of politicians like Farage.
Those who thought to build the Union would be an easy task, they were wrong. Those who thought that countries would not advance in the Union, they were wrong. Those who thought that United Kingdom inside of the Union would prevent more Union, they were wrong. Those who thought the euro would never exist, they were wrong. Those who thought the eurozone would break in the first economic crisis, they were wrong.  Those who thought the UK would drag other countries on their way out, they were wrong. There will be more Union now.

The eurozone has its own challenges but the Union has more dangers: unchecked illegal immigration or the entry of a country like Turkey.
It will not be easy, but in a global world, we will face the challenges and we will overcome them better united.

selber

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Re: The ECB and the target debt.
« Reply #9 on: July 18, 2017, 00:24 »
@JoseRuiz
I accept your comment as a good but not correct argument . Before I say what I find good, I say what I find wrong . A producer , should his product  get paid by the buyer . I'm no expert, but I will let explained to me by no experts that it should be different . I am also making the ECB responsible for the debt crisis . The ECB is a single disaster! The reason is the right to vote of the ECB . Whether Malta or Spain - each country has a voice . But money is not decided democratically, and the "democracy" of the ECB is also questionable . The owner of the money must decide about money, just as you do with you money . The ECB gives foreign countries the right to determine German money because the voting right does not correspond to the liability . This is the reason for the dysfunctionality of the ECB, which first let benefited some countries , but ultimately led to the crisis . In all the reforms Macron has planned , a reform of the ECB is not planned . Therefore the crisis will remain, only the burdens will be redistributed . You say all pay for Greece . No, the ECB paid , and paid for the ECB does only those  who can pay . Those are becoming less and less . Debts are a burden to the currency, and the difference in the burden to the euro is the redistribution by ECB . Target debt is also debt . Since where you are right is that we only together the problem of future can solve . But to do this, we should deal with each other fairly . Otherwise, we fail . Germany is dependent on Europe , pays for it but a high price . Do not overdo it , especially since mercantilism hurts everyone at the end . I  do not mean Germany led . More dragged to lead .
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 00:29 by selber »