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Author Topic: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.  (Read 862 times)

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selber

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2017, 05:53 »
@coffejohn

For me, Bitcoin sounds like the chips you get at the roulette table. But I also have no idea.

Quote
Electronic payments expert Dave Birch has said in the past that “one doesn’t invest in bitcoin, one gambles on bitcoin”. Those working in the area advise anyone planning on buying the currency to only invest as much as they are prepared to lose.


https://www.theguardian.com/money/2017/oct/01/will-bitcoin-ever-be-safe-investment-gamble

But there are experts who see it similar .

coffejohn

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2017, 11:28 »
@coffejohn

For me, Bitcoin sounds like the chips you get at the roulette table. But I also have no idea.
 

I have followed crypto for some years but have not "invested" in it (to my cost). I think it is now worth a second look but am concerned at the security vacuum it exists in. The various attempts to popularise crypto by developing mobile apps adds to the security dangers for new comers while established users seem to be adopting systems that are less user friendly but more secure.

 The second problem is establishing a value for crypto!
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coffejohn

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2017, 00:36 »

Bitcoin Prices Still Firmly Above $7000, Without China
From; https://www.forbes.com/sites/panosmourdoukoutas/2017/11/04/bitcoin-prices-still-firmly-above-7000-without-china/#5671eb006f02

Quote
What’s behind the digital currency’s breathtaking run?

Certainly, it isn’t the lifting of regulations which halted trade of digital currency in China, as some expected (back in September, China banned Initial Coin Offerings (ICOs) and shut Bitcoin exchanges, sending the digital currency’s price tumbling from $5000 to close to $3000).

Instead, there have been a number of positive developments that helped build investor confidence and hype in the “people’s” currency. One of them was the stepping up of government regulations in US and Japan to protect the cryptocurrency markets from possible manipulation, while limiting the supply of new coin offerings.


---------------

I cannot see any sensible reason for this continued surge in price but it is self evident that there is a market here ripe for speculation. But, I feel, not for investment.

My issues with Bitcoin and most other crypto`s are:

1- The organisations that control these "currencies" are the owners of the mining factories. These are becoming centralised to such an extent that they now dictate development and operational terms of trade within the system. This is contrary to the basic principle of crypto which is based upon the tenant of decentralisation.

2- Speed of transaction is now slowing down which means not only that it takes a long time to complete a deal but if the "currency" starts to crash it will be impossible for the vast majority of investors to get their money back without massive losses.

3- As government regulation is applied the trading companies will come to resemble conventional banks and investment houses negating the attraction of the "currency".



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selber

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #18 on: November 05, 2017, 12:30 »
@coffejohn Bitcoin is like a currency in the sea of countless currencies. Like any currency, a victim of speculators. If not interesting for speculators, then not for you or me. People are the problem, not currencies.It is always and everywhere about the money, and especially about the money of others.

coffejohn

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2017, 23:30 »

The magic money tree does exist, according to modern monetary theory

From; http://www.independent.co.uk/news/long_reads/actually-the-magic-money-tree-does-exist-according-to-modern-monetary-theory-a8021501.html


Quote
The crisis of the neoliberal order has resuscitated a political idea widely believed to be consigned to the dustbin of history. Brexit, the election of Donald Trump, and the neo-nationalist, anti-globalisation and anti-establishment backlash engulfing the West all involve a yearning for a relic of the past: national sovereignty.

In response to these challenging times, economist William Mitchell and political theorist Thomas Fazi reconceptualise the nation state as a vehicle for progressive change. They show how despite the ravages of neoliberalism, the state still contains resources for democratic control of a nation's economy and finances. The populist turn provides an opening to develop an ambitious but feasible left political strategy.

Reclaiming the State offers an urgent, provocative and prescient political analysis of our current predicament, and lays out a comprehensive strategy for revitalising progressive economics in the 21st century.

This is a long article based on the book; "Reclaiming the State A Progressive Vision of Sovereignty for a Post-Neoliberal World"  at ; http://www.independent.co.uk/news/long_reads/actually-the-magic-money-tree-does-exist-according-to-modern-monetary-theory-a8021501.html

and; https://www.plutobooks.com/9780745337326/reclaiming-the-state/



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coffejohn

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Re: Money. Gold, Fiat, Crypto and the Euro.
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2017, 23:49 »

Bitcoin has become the ultimate Klondyke.

From; http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-12-08/20-times-more-volatile-dollar

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very bank knows BTC’s extraordinary gains are a crowd delusion fuelled by the extraordinary promise of free wealth!


"Bitcoin is a Ponzi Scheme with no one in charge"

Quote
Bitcoin has been in existence for all of eight years but a debate is raging in the investing community: Is the cryptocurrency actually useful beyond just being a vehicle for speculation? At its worst, does it help facilitate highly questionable and illegal transactions and activity? JPMorgan CEO Jamie Dimon recently called bitcoin a “fraud” that “won’t end well.” The cryptocurrency is up 800% in the past year. So bitcoin investors can have a good laugh at Mr. Dimon’s expense, for now. Important questions and skepticism remain. Among the cryptocurrency's big skeptics is currency guru and bestselling author Jim Rickards. He sat down to discuss this (and much more) during a new "Real Conversation" with Hedgeye CEO Keith McCullough. Rickards begins: “This is the only topic where I agree with Jamie Dimon. I've been a pretty harsh critic of Jamie Dimon. But when he says 'it’s a fraud, it's a Ponzi'[ scheme]'-- I agree completely. I call it a Ponzi with no one in charge. There's no Madoff, but it's working that way.” While bitcoin has its fervent supporters, Rickards says the cryptocurrency invented in 2009 still has too much to prove, and is involved in too many shady transactions to be taken seriously. He cites things like drug dealing, arms dealing, money laundering and tax evasion, as well as "worse things that I don't want to even mention, more reprehensible than that." He goes on further: “Bitcoin has not been combat tested in a business cycle. We have not had a recession or a financial crisis since 2009. I’ve seen all these other asset classes go through many business cycles. I know how they’ll behave. Bitcoin has not been tested in that arena.” Rickards and McCullough both say they have both been accused of being "technophobic" because of their distaste for bitcoin. Rickards says that couldn’t be further from the truth. “A lot of my private equity investments are very forward-leaning in technology. I embrace technology. But I know a lot about markets. A lot of the tech groupies who love bitcoin know a lot about tech, but not so much about the markets.” Until proven otherwise, Rickards says investors should stay away. “For the market as a whole, for wealth managers, for people trying to preserve wealth, for investors, this is no place to be,” Rickards says.

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