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Author Topic: Realpolitik in Europe.  (Read 4297 times)

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Lugdu

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #120 on: November 22, 2017, 13:15 »
Peut-être que le système allemand est arrivé à un stade difficile parce que la répartition des votes s'est élargie. Le consensus devient donc difficile. Il se peut que A.Merkel soit bien adaptée au système démocratique allemand, mais que l'impasse n'ait pas été prévue ou oubliée. Elle ne peut pas faire plus grand écart politique : est-ce sa faute ?

selber

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #121 on: November 22, 2017, 13:28 »
@coffejohn
Must here something about German politics, is ultimately also European. Go across the flower, without transitions. Only my frustration here. The coalition between four parties  has failed. The FDP is accused. If the coalition had succeeded I would have accused all four. If parties that were before the election such as fire and water coalesce, the voter can only lose.The art of compromise is praised and demanded, but doing justice to all human beings is an art that nobody can.Concepts and ideas argue, come out foul compromises.It's like a restaurant, lots of fine food, but you can not agree on one, so - a little bit from each. Like the leftovers, every cook would be ashamed of it.The generous immigration policy, which is not generous enough for the Greens, was voted out. But the Greens are needed for a majority government. I would prefer a minority government that has  constantly find new majorities, always have to convince instead of governing with majority government against common sense.As far as Europe is concerned - Macron wants 60 billion of Germany every year, and with the exception of the FDP, everyone involved in the negotiations seemed to want to give it to him. This is not a mirror of the electorate. I am grateful to the FDP that this farce was bursting.Merkel is only at the end when her party is no longer behind her.That does not seem to be the case. But she can not switch and act as she pleases, that's progress.Germany has enough of its own problems, but many politicians want to save Europe (Macron's Ministry of Finance) and the world( klima , refugees ) before they deal with it.We have only briefly to save the world, then we'll come to you. :o
« Last Edit: November 22, 2017, 13:31 by selber »

coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #122 on: November 23, 2017, 11:17 »
@coffejohn
---Germany has enough of its own problems, but many politicians want to save Europe (Macron's Ministry of Finance) and the world( klima , refugees ) before they deal with it.We have only briefly to save the world, then we'll come to you. :o

This aspect of your post reflects part of the Brexit argument; that most member countries of the EU expect stronger members to solve their collective problems for them.

To be fair to Germany it has done it`s best over the decades to meet these demands but seems now to be tired of ever increasing expectations.
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coffejohn

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coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #124 on: December 13, 2017, 20:23 »

EU to UK: You’re not special

From; https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-to-uk-youre-not-special-brexit-talks-phase-2/

The UK wants ‘deep and special’ ties post-Brexit but the EU has other ideas.

By David M. Herszenhorn   

12/13/17, 6:45 PM CET

Updated 12/13/17, 7:17 PM CET

Quote
If the EU had to pick a theme song for Phase 2 of the Brexit talks, Gotye’s “Somebody That I Used to Know” could be the leading contender.

There are roughly 170 countries in the world that are not members of the European Union. And thanks to Brexit, on March 29, 2019, the United Kingdom becomes just one of that pack.

Looking ahead to discussions about the future relationship with the U.K., senior EU officials and diplomats are warning that the bloc has numerous partnerships, including trade agreements, with many countries, and Brussels has no intention of diminishing those arrangements by offering London a sweeter package.

That’s especially true, officials said, when it comes to Norway and Switzerland — the two big partners that pay into the EU budget to be part of its single market.

Quote
Put simply, the U.K. opted for a breakup and the EU is going to put loyal friends before its ex.

Or as Gotye, the Belgian-born musician, sings it: “You didn’t have to cut me off … Now you’re just somebody that I used to know.”


While this is simply an opinion piece it do`s raise important questions about the UK`s place in Europe.  The first probably relates to security while the second relates to governance.

I am confident that the EU27 can defend themselves and counter Russian/Iranian pressures on their boarders; at least with a little help from their American friends.

EU governance without our esteemed input also seems to be in good hands between Macron the Great and Schulz`s the Arbiter of  Loyalty to EU Integration. The UK has been seen as a drag on EU progress for some time so it will be interesting to see what creek it paddles itself up under it`s own power.

I certainly agree that the EU should put loyal friends first; I would like to know who these "friends" are though as the only "friends" the EU seems to have are those it bribes with UK and German money. Once the former stops and the latter dries up these fair weather friends will show their true worth.




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coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #125 on: December 14, 2017, 12:13 »

Europe faces defense spending challenge

New plans meet old obstacles.

By Janosch Delcker   

12/14/17, 4:00 AM CET

From; https://www.politico.eu/article/europe-defense-spending-challenge-new-transatlantic-order/

Quote
BERLIN — Goaded by Donald Trump, scared by Russia and eager to give fresh impetus to integration, Europe is gearing up to spend big on defense.

The challenge the Continent now faces, according to politicians, industry leaders and experts, is to spend wisely.

To get value for money and armed forces that truly increase their security, governments will have to overcome a reluctance to buy from foreign suppliers and collaborate on multinational projects — even when that means fewer jobs for their own industries.

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coffejohn

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selber

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #127 on: January 06, 2018, 11:45 »

For good or bad?
Nordstream is an economic decision, not a political one. It does not make us more dependent than we were before. Poland should be bypassed because the Poles were more expensive than a line through the Baltic Sea. Depending on Russia we are as always. But less dependent on Poland.

coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #128 on: January 14, 2018, 21:37 »

Germany edges closer to new coalition.

From; https://www.politico.eu/article/breakthrough-in-german-coalition-talks/

Quote
Germany inched toward installing a new government as Angela Merkel’s conservatives and leaders of the Social Democrats (SPD) reached agreement on the outline of a legislative agenda after marathon talks.

After negotiating non-stop for 24 hours to conclude exploratory talks, the parties agreed on a 28-page position paper, laying out their policy priorities for the coming years.

I find this article superficial and pitifully hopeful; the readers comments are more illuminating however;

Quote
wow

AFD n @ s i’s official opposition in soon.

shhhhh let’s not mention that anymore….. Not a squeak in the article of why they refused to form the coalition in the first place (to stop AFD being official opposition party)

SHAME on [email protected] Really. I mean it. Learnt nothing.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 9:59 AM CET
maciekimaciek

Another breakthtough?
Starts to be boring.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 10:26 AM CET
The Economist

Looking good for the AFD!!!! Official opposition and next time an even larger share of the vote!!!!! The Far Left CDU and SPD are nothing short of a disgrace, they put their own prejudices against AFD before the good of Country.

Wake up germans the far left merkel is your enemy!!!!

Posted on 1/12/18 | 10:54 AM CET
dc

Great !
I just wonder how CSU feels now about loosing coming local elections in Bavaria ?
If CSU is serious about saving Bavaria from Berlin madness they should leave Germany, join Austria and V4 countries and create a strong block that would be bale to defend basic European values and principles.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 11:26 AM CET
Ronald Grünebaum

The SPD will sign the deal because new elections would wipe them out.
Anyway.
The interesting bit is the broad agreement to beef up the German contribution to the EU budget. I guess Brexiteers need to bury yet another delusion, the one about the EU needing UK cash.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 12:56 PM CET
Zan

German press has a long history of redefining phrases in order to meet their propaganda objectives.
A breakthrough? Really? A successful completion of the pre-talk of the pre-talks? When two more approvals are necessary by resisting groups? Cmon Matthew, senior mainstream reporters are better than this… not.
The elephant in the room: there is no such solution that these 3 parties can all emerge as winners. There will be at least one big loser in this game and useless Schulz is trying to escape from the trap and make Merkel the loser by killing time which is on his side. However if those two will be winning then Seehofer will fail. At this point their goal is to maintain the status quo as Germany looks bad sank into political (and social) chaos until they figure out a polically not devastating „agreement” so they can do business as usual at somewhat harsher language..
To their horror Germans are sobering from the willkommenskultur and AFD will continue to gain power unless the leaders will put a full stop to the illegal migration and deport illegal masses. Tricky, Matthew, isn’t it.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 1:15 PM CET
Vishnou

A relief. No doubt compromises would be elaborated. Took some time but the political situation not being at its best with the challenges ahead, it is good news that the parties involved managed to remain open to each other’s proposals.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 1:15 PM CET
YellowSubmarine

@Ronald Grünebaum – The interesting bit is the broad agreement to beef up the German contribution to the EU budget. I guess Brexiteers need to bury yet another delusion, the one about the EU needing UK cash.

What is the extra German money going to pay for ? Is it to replace all of the lost UK contributions, or to pay for the compensation for regions and sectors across EU who will lose out if UK only get a basic deal, or to meet Junckers 20% increase in the EU’s upcoming budget?

I am sure German voters will be happy to see it’s cheque book opened at the expense of domestic requirements, like better internet, education and finishing off airports and so on. 😉

Posted on 1/12/18 | 1:39 PM CET
John

This is compomise politics of the highest order.
It is like divorcing you husband/wife after a domestic violence incident and, even though he/she is standing at the alter with a big hammer, agreeing to “try again for the sake of the kids ( for kids read German public)…”
This will all end in tears.

Posted on 1/12/18 | 2:00 PM CET
freddie silver

@ Vishnou
When are you going to read the words of the article and not what you would like it to say????

Posted on 1/12/18 | 2:32 PM CET
Vishnou

@FreddieSilver
You seem to be allergic to people developing their own opinion without relying on press cuttings. 🙂

Posted on 1/12/18 | 2:41 PM CET
freddie silver

@ Vishnou,
Then be open and honest about it: state that it is your opinion without sheltering under an article which says something different

Posted on 1/12/18 | 2:48 PM CET
contango

to all neo-marxist liberal treasonous kumbayas who opine in here

yes excellent development; couldn’t be better; a real breakthru

**a new coalition govmt more of the same of the last one, but with only 50% of the seats, as opposed to 80% i believe last time

** with a clearly eroded base,
**without even a semblance of a popular mandate,
**with a chancellor who’s approval numbers are dropping faster than u can say trump
**and with the AfD the official opposition in the bundestag

an excellent development indeed
let the good times roll

i am even thinking of moving to germany for a few months in the spring
this show is NOT to be missed

PS. memo to brits:

steadfast; don’t give me one single godamned quid

Posted on 1/12/18 | 3:37 PM CET
Hoser

Why are they negotiating in a prison cell?

Posted on 1/12/18 | 6:31 PM CET
moderateGuy

This deal will:
a. finish off the SPD completely (why vote for them if all they ever are is a junior partner to CDU)
b. further erode CDU (why vote for them if all they ever are is a senior partner for reheated socialist disaster)
c. grow AfD credibility by leaps and bounds (official opposition and a distinct program that is based on what voters actually want)
d. leave EU, the Franco-German colonial projects foundering
So, win-win-win-win

Posted on 1/12/18 | 7:40 PM CET
Filippo

Very good….so Jens Weidmann and VW Ceo eventually agreed on the program to send by email on PDF to Angela and Martin….it was about time, they used to be more timely

Posted on 1/12/18 | 8:41 PM CET
Zan

“This article has been updated with additional information.” Euphemism, Matthew, since you reworked the article big time including the new title.. anyway, I appreciate the effort and the reflection I’m sure you agree that this new version makes a lot more sense
Mainstream media put enough lipstick on the pig you see where Merkel ended up as a result. It’s about time to turn the page and do some true reporting
Cheers

Posted on 1/12/18 | 8:47 PM CET
Veritas-Semper

@moderate Guy

Very succinct and to the point. Unlike MK’s meanderings…

Posted on 1/12/18 | 9:26 PM CET
Gerhard

Social democrats are heading for self-destruction. The SPD will not be rewarded by the electorate for this.
The only acceptable result of the party talks is the strong commitment to the EU. Most social-democratic demands, however, have been rejected by the conservatives.
But not everything is cut and dried yet. The Social Democrats party leader promised to consult the party members to get their approval before any official and formal coalition talks begin. It is very uncertain that their verdict will be in favour of a new, grand coalition.
If the SPD forms the government with the Christian Democrats, the strongest opposition party will be the far-right AfD. Yet that does not mean that they will actually profit from that position – the AfD is very unpopular among the German population, and almost weekly there are news about another distasteful, racial or extremist comment by one of the AfD-members. Being the main opposition party will make their radicalism far more transparent and visible for the electorate.
The last main opposition party, and, accordingly, the opposition leader, was The Left – Die Linke. They have not really gained much additional support from being in that position during the last legislative period.
The only reasonable option for the Social Democrats is to reject what the party leadership intends – forming a new coalition. The proper solution would have been a minority government, supported by the democratic parties on a case-by-case situation, whenever one of those democratic parties agreed with the CDUs proposals.
The AfD, due to their extremist agenda, would and will be excluded from any agreement or other type of political collaboration.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 2:26 AM CET
wow

SHAME on [email protected] Really. I mean it. Learnt nothing.

i am an expert on learning nothing ever in life, so i should know!

Cheerio now.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 5:37 AM CET
Priscilla du Bleu

@Ronald Grünebaum
“The SPD will sign the deal because new elections would wipe them out.
Anyway.
The interesting bit is the broad agreement to beef up the German contribution to the EU budget. I guess Brexiteers need to bury yet another delusion, the one about the EU needing UK cash.”

This :-). As i stated in another thread, Schultz’s political career depends on getting a deal done. Otherwise his presumed return to Brussels might be a bit bumpy as well.

The increased german contributions will only increase Germany’s influence – even more -, and it won’t bother german taxpayers much, given the fact how healthy their economy is. Still and again.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 5:42 AM CET
Priscilla du Bleu

@YellowSubmarine
“I am sure German voters will be happy to see it’s cheque book opened at the expense of domestic requirements, like better internet, education and finishing off airports and so on. ”

Well THIS german voter (thanks to both citizenships i can vote in both countries 😀 ) certainly is happy with Mutti’s spending …. and if the additional payments make Germany’s topdog position within the EU only stronger, the money is well spent.

Ans no, i am not the only one …. there is a yuuuge part of germany society sharing my opinion.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 5:46 AM CET
Sonja

Priscilla du Bleu,
„there is a yuuuge part of germany society sharing my opinion.“? You ara absolutely wrong.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 4:40 PM CET
Priscilla du Bleu

@Sonja
“„there is a yuuuge part of germany society sharing my opinion.“? You ara absolutely wrong.”

Am I? The CDU scored, despite their losses, highest of all parties in september.

Posted on 1/13/18 | 9:00 PM CET


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Lugdu

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #129 on: January 15, 2018, 13:23 »
Ce qui m'inquiète pour l'Allemagne, c'est le maintien de basses rémunérations pour certains travailleurs. La nouvelle coalition politique a-t-elle ce problème en tête, ou est-ce le statut quo ?
Comment ce pays riche peut-il engendrer tant de pauvreté interne ?

La question se pose en France aussi, mais les ressorts ne sont pas les mêmes…

selber

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #130 on: January 15, 2018, 13:25 »
@coffejohn
I had hoped for new elections. Jamaica (the colors of its flag) failed due to the resistance of the yellow (FDP) to Macron's reform plans. The SPD with Schulz (!) will not oppose.It is not that a majority of German voters support such a policy, but many fear change and conflict. I do not have to scold Frenchmen, our biggest problem are we ourselves.

coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #131 on: January 15, 2018, 13:53 »
@coffejohn
I had hoped for new elections. Jamaica (the colors of its flag) failed due to the resistance of the yellow (FDP) to Macron's reform plans. The SPD with Schulz (!) will not oppose.It is not that a majority of German voters support such a policy, but many fear change and conflict. I do not have to scold Frenchmen, our biggest problem are we ourselves.

We in the UK are used to "change and conflict" in our politics, indeed they are integral to our adversarial system.  I think most brits would find the German political system systemically faulty in that it seems to be incapable of responding to change and external challenges; as is the EU as a whole.

 You may find that Germany is about to enter a new democratic phase now Merkel has been humbled; I see this as her "Thatchers moment", this being the time Thatcher lost the support of her party and after stating that she would not resign was forced to do so within weeks. The timeline may be longer for Merkel but the destination will be the same.

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coffejohn

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Re: Realpolitik in Europe.
« Reply #132 on: Yesterday at 14:58 »



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